Here is an old project of mine, that finally got finished, thanks to a huge effort by mogura to untangle the tricky language in here. I am eternally grateful for this.I got the inspiration to finish this now to present a counter-point to Akamatsu's posting on moe: http://4-ch.net/anime/kareha.pl/1122583157
Some additional translation notes:* The "money-making erotica" line is originally "moukarun ero", or "profitable porn".* Moe-tan does exist, for those who aren't aware of it. http://www.moetan.jp/* The "The wind that has had better be dead blew for example sentences" line is ABe's own, in English, parodying the silly phrases in the book.
LMAO Moustache...nice...Abe can't be any more awesome!Neither can you for translating those. As always, you rock. Thank you! XD
This is fantastic!
Oh, and speaking of Moe-tan...
since I don't know what MOE stands for either I'll just assume it has something to do with underage girls.
>>1319If you're not a troll, then you've just displayed the most elegant usage of applied ignorance in conversation that I've ever come across.Or, in other words: next time you post, make sure you know *something*, *anything* about the subject.
>>1320Maybe instead of lording it over him arrogantly, you could EXPLAIN it to them.
There's a perfectly good explanation in the comic!
>>1320I'm not a troll, I don't see why I can't ask/say anything about a topic I don't know anything about. Excuse me for not knowing all terms ever created :[ and yes I'm curious what Moe stands for since I see it mentioned a lot, and usually it is combined with images of very young girls in cute positions or whatever. So I assume my assumption of the meaning is correct?
I think your assumption there might be technically incorrect, but on another level, it shows a much clearer insight into the matter than might be comfortable to all those involved.All in all, "a most elegant usage of applied ignorance" indeed.
>>1324 Oh I'm sorry is this a sensitive topic? By all means leave me ignorant so I will misuse my interpretation of it even more.
Mo-eru: (Verb Intransitive) Sprout; To begin to grow; Give off shoots or buds; "the plant sprouted early this year..."So moe refers to something/someone that is young and/or growing (up). At least, that is how I am reading it. That about how you all read it?
>>1325 No, it's that it is not an easy word to explain. It's one of these ever-shifting subculture terms that has no concrete definition. The underlying joke of the original comic is that people are confused about what it means, and the comic just gives a completely non-sensical definition (ABe is no fan of moe). For another part of the discussion about the word, see the link the original post. It has Ken Akamatsu giving what he feels is a definition of the word (one that has some decent points, but that I disagree with overall).The reason I thought your original statement was amusing was that there *is* an undeniable undercurrent of pedophilia in the concept of moe, but there are no doubt many who would like to deny this.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mo%C3%A9
I just thought it was time to bump this thread back up to the very top, by mentioning that "Moe" has now made its very first appearance in a Japanese encyclopedia:http://headlines.yahoo.co.jp/hl?a=20051104-00000020-zdn_n-sci
>>1759 terawarosu!
>>1759uhm...http://ja.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=%E8%90%8C%E3%81%88&oldid=22804
All right... let me rephrase that... in a "real" encyclopedia made of dead trees.
The thing I don't get about moe, is that it's not supposed to be an overtly sexual thing; it's a warm, tender feeling, with a subtle sexual undercurrent. I've read that more than once, but it seems that often enough, creators of moe characters go to great lenghts to sexualize them. PetoPeto-san is the most obvious example, the characters are really cute, and I definitely see how one could feel moe for many of them, but then, they are sexualized so much that it makes me feel dirty. Petopeto's artist YUG has another manga called HemoHemo that features a very moe 14-year-old girl. I immediately see why she is moe. Undoubtedly, Japanese otaku in their 20's who would be reading this manga see her as a little sister. Hemohemo is completely devoid of any sexual images, the only instance of nudity is a bathing scene that's as innocent as the bathing scene in Totoro, yet watching your adolescent little sister taking a bath is sexual. I understand how something like that can fall under the moe umbrella, but not "oops I glomped your developing chest" - I expect to see that in something like Mai Hime or a harem anime.
The thing I don't get about moe, is that it's not supposed to be an overtly sexual thing; it's a warm, tender feeling, with a subtle sexual undercurrent. I've read that more than once, but it seems that often enough, creators of moe characters go to great lenghts to sexualize them. PetoPeto-san is the most obvious example, the characters are really cute, and I definitely see how one could feel moe for many of them, but then, they are sexualized so much that it makes me feel dirty.
Petopeto's artist YUG has another manga called HemoHemo that features a very moe 14-year-old girl. I immediately see why she is moe. Undoubtedly, Japanese otaku in their 20's who would be reading this manga see her as a little sister. Hemohemo is completely devoid of any sexual images, the only instance of nudity is a bathing scene that's as innocent as the bathing scene in Totoro, yet watching your adolescent little sister taking a bath is sexual. I understand how something like that can fall under the moe umbrella, but not "oops I glomped your developing chest" - I expect to see that in something like Mai Hime or a harem anime.
>PetoPeto-san is the most obvious example, the characters are really cute, and I definitely see how one could feel moe for many of them, but then, they are sexualized so much that it makes me feel dirty.Also, 'peto' is Finnish for 'beast'. ^_^
>PetoPeto-san is the most obvious example, the characters are really cute, and I definitely see how one could feel moe for many of them, but then, they are sexualized so much that it makes me feel dirty.
Also, 'peto' is Finnish for 'beast'. ^_^
>>1777 How do you claim with such certainty what moe is and isn't supposed to be?For instance, your example Mai-HiME makes a big deal out of being a moe show.
>>1777
How do you claim with such certainty what moe is and isn't supposed to be?
For instance, your example Mai-HiME makes a big deal out of being a moe show.
>>1779I don't claim to do anything. I only know what I read, and I've pointed out that I've read more than once that moe isn't a sexual thing. I don't see how Mai Hime is a moe show really. If Mai Hime is moe, than just about anything is moe.
>>1779
I don't claim to do anything. I only know what I read, and I've pointed out that I've read more than once that moe isn't a sexual thing.
I don't see how Mai Hime is a moe show really. If Mai Hime is moe, than just about anything is moe.
>>1780 Did you read it anywhere other than Akamatsu's original blog entry, and the people commenting on that? Because that's the only place I've really seen this claim made. And it definitely shouldn't be taken too seriously.
>>1780
Did you read it anywhere other than Akamatsu's original blog entry, and the people commenting on that? Because that's the only place I've really seen this claim made. And it definitely shouldn't be taken too seriously.
>>1781"When I told this to my friend Yanashita, he told me 'That's called "Moe", when you feel girl a girl is adorable without having sexual desire.'"source: http://www.japattack.com/japattack/culture/moe.html"o many moé-loyalists, the point is on supporting and watching rather than to imagine being actively involved with the character, with sexual implications being awkward or distasteful."source: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mo%C3%A9"Moe distinguishes itself from sexual fetishism because it does not necessarily involve sexual desire, as some people simply enjoy having the feeling, "just as a working girl often decorates her office computer with tiny cartoon figures and feels happy," the source said."source: http://search.japantimes.co.jp/print/news/nn07-2005/nn20050715f2.htm"Moe eroticism is often divorced from any kind of physical sexuality. Actual sex would destroy the nonthreatening, childlike innocence that comprises much of the characters' appeal."source: http://www.tcj.com/messboard/ubb/Forum3/HTML/000646-5.htmlShould I keep going?
>>1781
"When I told this to my friend Yanashita, he told me 'That's called "Moe", when you feel girl a girl is adorable without having sexual desire.'"source: http://www.japattack.com/japattack/culture/moe.html
"o many moé-loyalists, the point is on supporting and watching rather than to imagine being actively involved with the character, with sexual implications being awkward or distasteful."source: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mo%C3%A9
"Moe distinguishes itself from sexual fetishism because it does not necessarily involve sexual desire, as some people simply enjoy having the feeling, "just as a working girl often decorates her office computer with tiny cartoon figures and feels happy," the source said."source: http://search.japantimes.co.jp/print/news/nn07-2005/nn20050715f2.htm
"Moe eroticism is often divorced from any kind of physical sexuality. Actual sex would destroy the nonthreatening, childlike innocence that comprises much of the characters' appeal."source: http://www.tcj.com/messboard/ubb/Forum3/HTML/000646-5.html
Should I keep going?
Sorry fucked up the Wikipedia quote. It should say "To many moé-loyalists." Anyway, I'm not trying to insist that moe IS not sexual. I'm only expressing my confusion because it's been defined as such.
Sorry fucked up the Wikipedia quote. It should say "To many moé-loyalists."
Anyway, I'm not trying to insist that moe IS not sexual. I'm only expressing my confusion because it's been defined as such.
>>1783 I think your confusion comes from thinking that these are definitions. As I said in >>1328, this isn't a term with a definition - it means different things to different people, and at different times.
>>1783
I think your confusion comes from thinking that these are definitions. As I said in >>1328, this isn't a term with a definition - it means different things to different people, and at different times.
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